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What is a Universalist? - 10/16/2007 7:18:48 PM
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beloved06
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Hey guys, I just discovered a friend of mine is a "Unitarian Universalist."
What exactly is that? What do they believe?
I'd appreciate any insight on this matter.
Thank you very much.
Your sister,
beloved
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/16/2007 8:17:45 PM
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rosswell59
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They believe that there is no such thing as the trinity, that all people are going to be saved and that God can be anything you want Him/her to be.
Yours in Christ,
Ross
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 12:10:41 AM
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LCannon
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'Universalism is a religion and theology that generally holds all persons and creatures are related to God or the divine and will be reconciled to God. A church that calls itself Universalist may emphasize the universal principles of most religions and accept other religions in an inclusive manner, believing in a Universal reconciliation between humanity and the divine. Other religions may have Universalist theology as one of their tenets and principles, including Ananda Marga, Christianity, Hinduism, and some of the New Age religions. Universalist beliefs exist within many faiths, and many Universalists practice in a variety of traditions, drawing upon the same universal principles but customizing the practice to suit their audience...'
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universalism)
_____________________________
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only Bach. I am sure, however, that when they are together en famille they
play Mozart and then too our dear Lord listens with special pleasure."(Karl Barth)
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 12:37:14 AM
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figmentPez
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rosswell59
They believe that there is no such thing as the trinity, that all people are going to be saved and that God can be anything you want Him/her to be.
That would be the "unitarian" part, not the "universalist" part.
Universalists believe that all of humanity will be saved from their sins. Unitarian universalists just happen to think that salvation can come from just about anywhere.
Here is a good resource on universalism
http://www.carm.org/universalism.htm
with a specific page on Unitarians
http://www.carm.org/uni/unitarianism.htm
Unitarians deny that Jesus Christ is God, they are not Christians.
_____________________________
I make this challenge to all Christians:
Read Daniel 7:13-14
And tell me: Who do you say that the Son of Man is?
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 12:13:19 PM
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Soxfan
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If they believe that ALL humanity will be saved, then what was the purpose of Jesus Christ?
Also, why would there need to be a hell as mentioned in the Bible?
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"This would be the first step in apostasy; men first forget the true, and then adore the false.".......C.H. Spurgeon
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 1:14:41 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
If they believe that ALL humanity will be saved, then what was the purpose of Jesus Christ?
Also, why would there need to be a hell as mentioned in the Bible?
They will usually say that Jesus Christ was a good person, a good prophet/voice of how life should be lead. But they will not say He is God, King of Kings and Lord of Lords. They will not say Jesus is the Alpha and the Omega.
They will say that Jesus was later made deity by others and that he never claimed to be God.
As for hell? They usually say that it is misunderstood by Christians - that it is a state of mind and or that life here on earth is hell already.
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Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 1:23:39 PM
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bob97
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quote:
If you think about it, though, no agnostics or atheists will be in hell...
And where will they be...Walmart?
Bob
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The LORD is my high ridge, my stronghold, my deliverer!
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 1:25:17 PM
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earthless
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bob97
quote:
If you think about it, though, no agnostics or atheists will be in hell...
And where will they be...Walmart?
Bob
Now that's Hell on earth indeed!
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 1:29:37 PM
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deehall
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True story!!!
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One minute your defending the whole galaxy.....and suddenly you find yourself suckin' down Dargeeling with Marie Antionette and her little sister!
Buzz Lightyear-one of the greatest minds of the 21st Century!
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 6:52:53 PM
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figmentPez
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quote:
ORIGINAL: deehall
Figmentpez,
No disrespect but.......
I believe that is what Rosswell said
You're absolutely right, I posted too quickly, not taking time to carefully read the whole of Rosswell's post. I apologize.
I should have made clear that it is rejection of trinitarian doctrine that is the "unitarian" part. Not all universalists are also unitarian, though history shows that universalist groups tend to move towards unitarian theology over time.
_____________________________
I make this challenge to all Christians:
Read Daniel 7:13-14
And tell me: Who do you say that the Son of Man is?
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 7:33:48 PM
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rosswell59
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quote:
Roswell said: that God can be anything you want Him/her to be. (which I took it as being saved from a rock if you want)
Even deehall or rosswell if you like. That's really the root of the matter.
Yours in Christ,
Ross
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/17/2007 9:56:41 PM
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psende
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quote:
ORIGINAL: JimboFletch
If you think about it, though, no agnostics or atheists will be in hell...
Good one. 
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/18/2007 3:51:58 PM
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Dred
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
If they believe that ALL humanity will be saved, then what was the purpose of Jesus Christ?
To save all humanity, of course.
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/18/2007 4:04:02 PM
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Dred
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As for Unitarian Universalists, I would say that, in general, they are neither Unitarian nor universalist. From surveys I've seen, nearly half are atheists and thus could not be Unitarian since that is a view of God and could not be universalists either because that would indicate some kind of pleasant afterlife for all. As for the other half, many are oriented toward reverence for nature or eastern religion. The U/U's are basically an association for people who have spiritual/philosophical sorts of interests.
The Unitarians started out as one of those goofy little sects denying the Deity of Christ, much like Jehovah's Witnesses. Then they drifted into believing very little. I believe the universalist denomination was once pretty much Christian, but drifted into more of a pluralist rather than Christian universalist theology. So, with neither really having any firm beliefs, it was easy for them to join together in the early 1960's.
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/19/2007 5:02:43 PM
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figmentPez
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dred
quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
If they believe that ALL humanity will be saved, then what was the purpose of Jesus Christ?
To save all humanity, of course.
Well, aside from the fact that Jesus Christ said that not all of humanity would be saved, there's also the issue of UUs not believing that Jesus Christ is necessary for salvation.
quote:
I believe the universalist denomination was once pretty much Christian, but drifted into more of a pluralist rather than Christian universalist theology.
Unfortunately, all groups I know of that started out as "christian" universalists, have ended up dropping any pretense of being Christian, eventually.
_____________________________
I make this challenge to all Christians:
Read Daniel 7:13-14
And tell me: Who do you say that the Son of Man is?
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/21/2007 5:27:36 PM
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Dred
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quote:
Unfortunately, all groups I know of that started out as "christian" universalists, have ended up dropping any pretense of being Christian, eventually.
I actually don't know of any other really organized groups of christian universalists. Do you have others in mind? I'd agree that the UU's don't pretend to be christian any longer, though a small minority of it's membership still claim that label in some way.
Your mention of that reminds me of a similar trend in organized, denominational Christianity. That is, the trend toward theological liberalism and denying biblical authority. Most started out quite conservative and wanted to be biblical, but most major denominations have at least done some serious wrestling with whether they'll allow gay clergy, for one thing. Also, you'll see polls of the leadership or seminary faculty of major denominations in which most are denying most of the fundamental doctrines of Christianity. Consequently, you'll see a more biblically oriented subset break off, such as the P.C.A. from the P.C.U.S.A. and the American Anglican Council from the Episcopal Church. Universalists don't seem to be the only ones plagued by this kind of drift. It may tend to be worse because of the liberal pluralists naturally being attracted to a universalist church. I think it has more to do with pride, particularly of an intellectual kind. I think this is why Southern Baptists have held off this kind of thing remarkably well. In particular, it is governed from the bottom up rather than top down. The common folk tend to be much more conservative theologically and just don't know anything better than taking the Bible at it's word.
What do you think?
Ed
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/23/2007 6:11:56 PM
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figmentPez
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dred
What do you think?
I think that's off-topic for this thread.
_____________________________
I make this challenge to all Christians:
Read Daniel 7:13-14
And tell me: Who do you say that the Son of Man is?
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/25/2007 4:56:08 PM
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Dred
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quote:
ORIGINAL: figmentPez
I think that's off-topic for this thread.
I guess you are right about that. However, I got the impression (perhaps wrongly) that you meant to suggest the idea that universalism naturally results in a state of decay leading to the abandonment of all Christian fundamentals. I don't know that one example in which a universalist denomination lost all Christian distinctives and consequently joined up with the Unitarians is sufficient evidence for that proposition, particularly in light of the general trend for denominations governed by an elite body to enter a similar state of decay. So, that was my point in bringing that up and it is an interesting question in itself, but probably appropriate for a different thread, as you indicated. I must confess I don't even know much about the history or original distinctives of the Universalist denomination before it joined with the Unitarians and I don't know of any other universalist denominations or formal "groups" at all. Knowing so little about organized universalist groups, I'm still wondering which are the ones you had in mind that dropped "any pretense of being Christian, eventually?" It may be correct to refer to one such group as "all groups I know of," but I got the impression you were speaking of more than one and am curious.
Looking at the original post, the question in which the thread starter was apparently more interested was "What is a Unitarian Universalist?" I've actually known several of those, mostly university professors who, for various reasons, wanted to attend a "church" or become a part of a group discussing spiritual issues, but who didn't want to be expected to adhere to any particular beliefs. The UU "church" is perfect for that.
Ed
< Message edited by Dred -- 10/25/2007 5:23:24 PM >
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/25/2007 5:45:55 PM
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Dred
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quote:
Original: deehall
It is scary to believe that all people will be going to heaven. Rapists, Murderers, child molesters, Right! 
I'm sure the idea is that such people will be changed first (truly saved from their sins, not just some unpleasant consequences of their sins) so that heaven won't be a bad neighborhood. I guess there will be former rapists, murderers, and even child molesters there--even Paul the foremost of sinners.
"It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all." --Paul, as told to Timothy (1:15, NAS)
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 10/26/2007 9:11:45 AM
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1love1God1way
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dred
quote:
Original: deehall
It is scary to believe that all people will be going to heaven. Rapists, Murderers, child molesters, Right!
I'm sure the idea is that such people will be changed first (truly saved from their sins, not just some unpleasant consequences of their sins) so that heaven won't be a bad neighborhood. I guess there will be former rapists, murderers, and even child molesters there--even Paul the foremost of sinners.
"It is a trustworthy statement, deserving full acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, among whom I am foremost of all." --Paul, as told to Timothy (1:15, NAS)
It kind of reminds me of Jim Gaffigan, talking about going up and seeing the Pearly Gates, and wondering "Why does heaven need gates? We die and go to a gated community? What kind of neighborhood is heaven in?"
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 11/11/2007 9:18:58 AM
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time_is_at_hand
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a universalist believes these scriptures------------
Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
1Ti 4:9 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation.
1Ti 4:10 For therefore we both labor and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of those that believe.
1Ti 4:11 These things command and teach.
1Co 15:19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
1Co 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
1Co 15:21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Co 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
1Co 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
1Co 15:25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
1Co 15:27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
1Co 15:28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
_____________________________
1Co 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
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RE: What is a Universalist? - 11/12/2007 12:51:36 PM
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Him4all
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1love1God1way
quote:
It kind of reminds me of Jim Gaffigan, talking about going up and seeing the Pearly Gates, and wondering "Why does heaven need gates? We die and go to a gated community? What kind of neighborhood is heaven in?"
That's a good one. I was once told that the most important 'pearly gates' were the ones people saw when they looked at a Christians mouth. Unfortunately too many of those gates are in need of repair.
time_is_at_hand
Great scriptures IMO.
Aphobos
That sounds more like an AA definition to me. But then I'm not an AAer so I might be wrong.
DR
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